Water and other political issues.

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Re: Water and other political issues.

Post by Toss » Fri May 24, 2019 4:26 pm

gingertom wrote:
Fri Feb 05, 2016 7:31 pm
http://www.irishtimes.com/election-2016/dun-laoghaire

Exerpt;

At a recent convention the party’s other TD in the constituency, Mary Mitchell O’Connor, has been nominated to run again at the next election. Party headquarters is expected to nominate a second candidate. Experienced councillors Barry Ward and Maria Bailey contested the convention, with Barry Ward finishing in second place to the sitting TD. However, the imperative of running more women candidates to meet the 30 per cent gender quota could tip the balance in favour of Bailey.

Thoughts? Firstly I will state that I am non party, non polemic and being merely critically analytical.I am an ardent follower of current affairs. Presently it is my experience if one comments on what is in populist thought in present day Ireland, especially in gender issues and what regarding what was known as patriarchal practises in Ireland, it leaves the commentator open to claims of misogyny, amongst other possible anti women/minority accusations.
Anyway, I will say that she is new blood in terms of membership of the Dáil if she is successful. A pretty face is now a political attribute.
I nonetheless, wish her well in her campaign for election. Two good candidates but no room for one, only because of gender.
Positive discrimination in action. Back to the old days, but now it may be Matriarchy instead of Patriarchy??? It is Discrimination to achieve equality, without the consideration of ability or it ignored? Is this replacing one old bad practice with a new bad ideology? Is Ireland reacting in its usual method of over compensating in resolution of serious historical imbalances?
Meritocracy ideology not considered.
Gender aside, it is good to see new candidates for the electorate to select irrespective of gender or orientation, if applicable. For me it is the credentials of the candidate that are empirical, not accident of birth humanity.
Well GT, it seems the pretty face has made all the wrong headlines this week and left her backers with egg on their faces :lol: claim culture has been brought to a new level by Daddys Girl in Killiney .... poor Maria just shot herself in the foot career wise as she sued the Dean Hotel for not telling her how to use a swing seat. This is an elected representative telling us she needs instructions on how to use a swing...... can anyone really blame the parasites out there making dubious insurance claims when our so called leaders are showing them how. I cant help but feel sorry for the gullible voters who gave her their No. 1 in the last election.

Speaking of elections, the Euro Millions Elections have certainly attracted a huge number of runners such is the rewards for the winners ..... and some people believe there is no money in politics !


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Re: Water and other political issues.

Post by gingertom » Fri May 24, 2019 5:01 pm

Toss,
Barry Ward is a Barrister. Quite a lot of our local councillors actually are too.

https://www.lawlibrary.ie/members/Mr-Ba ... /4439.aspx

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/p ... 43356.html

The media have certainly spun this story as one of compo culture in Ireland.
In reality, everybody should take responsibility for their own actions whether negligent or not.
This applies to politicians too. She may well have done good work as a politician but the
story is a curious one. Additionally, the doctrine of negligence is a curious beast too, it being all about responsibility.
I don't understand why publicans or hotel owners are putting swings into an environment
where alcohol is served and they may be held to account for misfortunes that may or may not happen on their premises. Effective supervision of the swing by the Hotelier may have been absent and attributed to the incident.
As crazy as it sounds there probably should be a system of usage drawn up for use and if this is not present such can be used as a basis for a claim for damages. Just as the workplace should have a Safety Statement, illustrating a safe system of work.
Most fun fairs will prohibit patrons who have consumed alcohol from admission to ride on the attractions, so the installation of swings in pubs baffles me.
That said, Ms Bailey was not compelled to use it either.
The refusal to accept an offer to settle is normal within litigation prior to a court hearing.

The facts here are not fully reported and therefore a full conclusion cannot and should not be made until a full determination has been reached.
It's curious that the release of this story has escaped just when the local and European Elections are upon us!!!!

Check out Shane Ross's twitter feed.....great picture of
him on a swing in the Goat pub.
I don't endorse either by the way or Ms Bailey.


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Re: Water and other political issues.

Post by bugrock » Fri May 24, 2019 11:30 pm

Geez, Toss, you have me flat out with me dictionary and Google. But fair play, it's up to me to level up with them big words. Keep 'em coming, you'll make a scholar out of me yet!


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Re: Water and other political issues.

Post by Toss » Mon May 27, 2019 8:55 pm

I have to hand it to Ms Bailey ....... blameless and shameless : https://www.irishtimes.com/news/politic ... -1.3905867

She plays the victim very well ...... as she told Sean :
I'm hurt
I’m quite happy to sit at home, pyjamas on, on the couch, with the kids
Due to the unbelievable abuse I wasn’t able to go home for three days last week
Sean, I was injured. I am the one who suffered an injury. I never claimed for compensation.
Running is a cornerstone of my well being and keeping me medicated to offset cluster migraines.
It is in the claim and that is wrong.
Sean I’m not a legal person, I took legal advice on this and I put every faith into that legal system and I was told I had a clear cut case.
I am not bowing down to keyboard warriors and bullies.
I am a strong female politician, and some people don’t like that.


I love the way that she dismisses her affidavit claiming she was injured for three months as not relative because she could have amended it before it went to court, so the question is : Why claim for 3 months in the first place ? rest assured that was not her fault either, she just stopped short of blaming the Madigans (her solicitors).

She is brilliant...... Victim card played, abuse card played, family card played, mother card played, bully card played.
Shes a future TEASHOCK :lol:


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Re: Water and other political issues.

Post by gingertom » Tue May 28, 2019 6:59 am

Toss,
Baileys decision to be interviewed may have backfired. I'm not sure she was as convincing at 'playing cards' as you say.
It sounded like a whinge really and the public generally doesn't appreciate that. Maybe a seat up for grabs here in Dún Laoghaire soon or even a general election in the not too distant future. Not because of her but of the time available to get a new Dáil in place before Brexit on 31st October.


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Re: Water and other political issues.

Post by Strum » Tue May 28, 2019 2:19 pm

A good question posed by a qualified physiotherapist is how on earth she ran up a bill of 7000 euros in only three weeks of intensive physiotherapy?



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Re: Water and other political issues.

Post by Toss » Tue May 28, 2019 3:45 pm

gingertom wrote:
Tue May 28, 2019 6:59 am
Toss,
Baileys decision to be interviewed may have backfired. I'm not sure she was as convincing at 'playing cards' as you say.
It sounded like a whinge really and the public generally doesn't appreciate that. Maybe a seat up for grabs here in Dún Laoghaire soon or even a general election in the not too distant future. Not because of her but of the time available to get a new Dáil in place before Brexit on 31st October.
We are at the point where our elected representatives seem to believe they are invincible as the voting public have become so dumbed down that they dont even bother voting or challenging the chancers. What would any rational person think when a local councillor who demanded €10,000 cash as opening gambit for his support on a business deal in his constituency gets re-elected for a tenth time in a row ???? Nice one Hugh McElvaney, you're a great joker worshipcx worshipcx I wonder how those who voted for Ms Bailey feel today ? are they even bothered ?
Strum wrote:
Tue May 28, 2019 2:19 pm
A good question posed by a qualified physiotherapist is how on earth she ran up a bill of 7000 euros in only three weeks of intensive physiotherapy?
oh thats easy .... the poor innocent woman needed advice on what to do, so she called all her mates aboard the insurance gravy train as it turned into a feeding frenzy. Thats how the Insurance claim system works these days, its a complete job creation circle with both defendant and plaintiff trying to outdo each other with expert opinion .... they all know each other, they all know exactly how long it will take and how it will end. Everyones a winner and nobody will stand up and call a halt to it for fear of shooting the goose that laid the golden egg.


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Re: Water and other political issues.

Post by Sinead » Thu May 30, 2019 6:09 am

What interesting reading this makes, I find it fascinating that one of our 'highly educated' could get things so wrong again! At a public meeting regarding the Clonkeen Playing Fields the same female representative clearly showed a complete lack of understanding of the issue, on that occasion her father was on hand to rescue the situation.
How a person with half a brain can expect to sit on a swing, wearing high heels, 'holding a beer and reaching for a bottle of wine' these are her words, without mishap leaves me scratching my head. Where, oh where, was Daddy on that occasion or on the day of the radio interview.
Had she booked into Caritas for two weeks the cost would have been €2,400.00 including daily physio!



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Re: Water and other political issues.

Post by gingertom » Thu May 30, 2019 8:11 am

Toss wrote:
Tue May 28, 2019 3:45 pm
gingertom wrote:
Tue May 28, 2019 6:59 am
Toss,
Baileys decision to be interviewed may have backfired. I'm not sure she was as convincing at 'playing cards' as you say.
It sounded like a whinge really and the public generally doesn't appreciate that. Maybe a seat up for grabs here in Dún Laoghaire soon or even a general election in the not too distant future. Not because of her but of the time available to get a new Dáil in place before Brexit on 31st October.
We are at the point where our elected representatives seem to believe they are invincible as the voting public have become so dumbed down that they dont even bother voting or challenging the chancers. What would any rational person think when a local councillor who demanded €10,000 cash as opening gambit for his support on a business deal in his constituency gets re-elected for a tenth time in a row ???? Nice one Hugh McElvaney, you're a great joker worshipcx worshipcx I wonder how those who voted for Ms Bailey feel today ? are they even bothered ?
Strum wrote:
Tue May 28, 2019 2:19 pm
A good question posed by a qualified physiotherapist is how on earth she ran up a bill of 7000 euros in only three weeks of intensive physiotherapy?
oh thats easy .... the poor innocent woman needed advice on what to do, so she called all her mates aboard the insurance gravy train as it turned into a feeding frenzy. Thats how the Insurance claim system works these days, its a complete job creation circle with both defendant and plaintiff trying to outdo each other with expert opinion .... they all know each other, they all know exactly how long it will take and how it will end. Everyones a winner and nobody will stand up and call a halt to it for fear of shooting the goose that laid the golden egg.

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/politic ... -1.3908743

Toss, The public are not dumbed down, they are actively watching the politicians. Senior FG reps said its the very reason why there is a problem for their party and its because the public are aware of it.
Ms Baily has made a significant error of judgment in making that interview and could pay for it by losing her seat.


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Re: Water and other political issues.

Post by Toss » Thu May 30, 2019 12:27 pm

gingertom wrote:
Thu May 30, 2019 8:11 am

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/politic ... -1.3908743

Toss, The public are not dumbed down, they are actively watching the politicians. Senior FG reps said its the very reason why there is a problem for their party and its because the public are aware of it.
Ms Baily has made a significant error of judgment in making that interview and could pay for it by losing her seat.
52% of the electorate did not bother voting ..... I'm sorry, but thats not the actions of a smart electorate for me. Apathy and disillusionment is commonspread and it is reinforced when we have situations that suggest politicians are operating on a 'do as we say and not as we do' basis. My guess is the days will pass quickly, next week Ms Bailey will probably play the stress card along with a thinly veiled apology for her innocence and misunderstading of the situation that her 'advisors' put her in :roll: Leo will say how serious the FG party took the issue and how they have dealt with it 'in house' and the issue is now resolved with a new guideline for Politicians who wish to persue personal claims. Move along .... nothing to see here.

Ps
Should Leo dismiss Ms Bailey and make it clear that he is calling the shots (not hiding behind third party opinion) .... then I would be really impressed, but I won't hold my breath waiting on that.


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Re: Water and other political issues.

Post by Sinead » Thu May 30, 2019 2:36 pm

Folks, is there a register of 'claimants' and whether or not they were successful or not? It seems to me that recently a lot of judges have been dismissing claims as spurious and/or multiple claimants.
Toss, I don't think this matter can be swept under the carpet, I believe other matters may come during/under this investigation. As soon as Brexit is sorted out I believe there will be a General Election and Leo et al cannot come out with egg on their face on any matter or subject.
Gingertom, many Councillors may have qualified Barrister-at-law or Solicitor but if they do not practise this trade they may not be up to speed with current law/s and the understanding of it.



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Re: Water and other political issues.

Post by skins » Thu May 30, 2019 4:57 pm



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Re: Water and other political issues.

Post by Rocker » Fri May 31, 2019 1:10 am

I have never met the swing lady nor have any knowledge of her capabilities. But, I have been at so many functions, openings, commemorations etc in the last year and every local politician I have ever heard of has been there in droves. Clapping each other on the back and "been seen" and having hundreds of "photo opportunities" They are there just to be seen and mostly have little interest in the actual occasion.


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Re: Water and other political issues.

Post by Toss » Fri May 31, 2019 1:13 am

Very interesting reading Skins...... donations are great Ted eh? it was just resting in my account Dougal ... oh yes Ted, right !!!


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Re: Water and other political issues.

Post by Rocker » Fri May 31, 2019 1:16 am

I am just so sad reading this. How have I gone around all my life not background checking those who put themselves forward for positions??If these things are true shame on the man shame on him.
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And it must follow, as the night the day,
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Re: Water and other political issues.

Post by Sinead » Fri May 31, 2019 6:55 am

Rocker people of a certain calibre have no concept of SHAME - they set a path and see no wrong in what they do. You can hear many more stories from people involved in GAA locally.

Toss, we are forever being told of our highly educated citizens - how does that match with 52% not using the most precious franchise we have the right to vote? I left Caritas on Friday last and on the way home my 13 year old grandson asked "are you going to vote"? He minded me on my knee scooter into the Polling Station.

Skins, many thanks for the broadsheet.ie however, I would still like to know if there is a register of 'claimants' my gut tells me there would be more of interest if such a list exists.



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Re: Water and other political issues.

Post by Strum » Sat Jun 01, 2019 2:09 pm

Toss wrote:
Fri May 31, 2019 2:01 pm
how quickly people forget that the Green Partys Ciarán Cuffe TD wrote on his blog in 2007 that "a deal with Fianna Fáil would be a deal with the devil" and next thing we know the two parties were in power together.

I'm guessing the youth of today gave their votes to the greens over the global warming issue thinking the party are "supposed" to be all about the environment.

I may as well have wiped my ass with my vote for the local independent for all he can do with his promises to build social housing and change the healthcare system. :roll:



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Re: Water and other political issues.

Post by gingertom » Sat Jun 01, 2019 3:00 pm

All political manifestos are an exercise in the art of the possible and serve only to grab the vote.
Doorstep promises seem to be as useless as pillow talk!
The environment is a hot topic for the younger person. When we have fourteen-year-old Scandinavian lecturing
world leaders, it encourages her peers to use their voices too.


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Re: Water and other political issues.

Post by Toss » Tue Jul 23, 2019 11:32 pm

Toss wrote:
Thu May 30, 2019 12:27 pm
My guess is the days will pass quickly, next week Ms Bailey will probably play the stress card along with a thinly veiled apology for her innocence and misunderstanding of the situation that her 'advisor's put her in :roll:Leo will say how serious the FG party took the issue and how they have dealt with it 'in house' and the issue is now resolved with a new guideline for Politicians who wish to pursue personal claims. Move along .... nothing to see here.

Ps
Should Leo dismiss Ms Bailey and make it clear that he is calling the shots (not hiding behind third party opinion) .... then I would be really impressed, but I won't hold my breath waiting on that.
Sinead wrote:
Thu May 30, 2019 2:36 pm

Toss, I don't think this matter can be swept under the carpet, I believe other matters may come during/under this investigation. As soon as Brexit is sorted out I believe there will be a General Election and Leo et al cannot come out with egg on their face on any matter or subject.
I think this tweet from Gript says it all ....

Maria Bailey makes a DODGY #swing claim, but keeps the whip and backing of Taoiseach. Lucinda Creighton voted with her conscience on abortion, upholding the party's promises on the issue, but was ostracised and forced out.

This is the new, progressive Fine Gael.


Shameless and still they gets votes....


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Re: Water and other political issues.

Post by Sinead » Wed Jul 24, 2019 9:16 am

Toss, I would like to see the report into the 'Swing Affair' the TD will lose about €9,000 p.a. I wonder how the electorate will treat her in the next election.
Elections cost the state and local authorities money which is ultimately our taxes, ergo I believe anyone standing for election should be required to submit a Tax Clearance Certificate and a Health Certificate.
A recently elected individual to DLRCOCO, attended the first meeting but has since died. Was this person fit to stand? Do we now have to have a bye-election or is a person seconded to fill the vacancy?



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Re: Water and other political issues.

Post by Toss » Wed Jul 24, 2019 12:44 pm

Indeed Sinead, we would all like to see the report (the original unedited commercially insensitive version obviously) but that door has been closed.

As for the €9k ....... I would have a wild guess that Ms Bailey will be appointed onto some other committee within the year and not an eyelid will be raised.

I like the idea that those running for public office should have a tax clearance certificate, but trying to find out who has what in terms of money is not easy as it is common practice to put certain investments in partners or children's names in order to avoid attention ......... I would like to see anyone seeking election have to declare all family holding etc, that way when land is rezoned or bought by the state it would be clear if there is any conflict of interest (same would apply to state contracts with companies where candidates have a second party interest).

As for the next election ...... time will tell but I expect the Dun Laoghaire electorate will vote with their fears and keep the status quo.


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Re: Water and other political issues.

Post by Rocker » Thu Jul 25, 2019 10:46 am

Sinead wrote:
Wed Jul 24, 2019 9:16 am
Toss, I would like to see the report into the 'Swing Affair' the TD will lose about €9,000 p.a. I wonder how the electorate will treat her in the next election.
Elections cost the state and local authorities money which is ultimately our taxes, ergo I believe anyone standing for election should be required to submit a Tax Clearance Certificate and a Health Certificate.
A recently elected individual to DLRCOCO, attended the first meeting but has since died. Was this person fit to stand? Do we now have to have a bye-election or is a person seconded to fill the vacancy?

I looked at a photo of the first meeting of the Council and saw Mr Bailey looking very ill in a wheelchair. I was startled and don't know how long he was ill. I would say that someone will be seconded into his vacancy. I have no knowledge of any F.G personnel. Sad for his family.


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Re: Water and other political issues.

Post by gingertom » Wed Jul 31, 2019 8:53 pm

Toss wrote:
Tue Jul 23, 2019 11:32 pm
Toss wrote:
Thu May 30, 2019 12:27 pm
My guess is the days will pass quickly, next week Ms Bailey will probably play the stress card along with a thinly veiled apology for her innocence and misunderstanding of the situation that her 'advisor's put her in :roll:Leo will say how serious the FG party took the issue and how they have dealt with it 'in house' and the issue is now resolved with a new guideline for Politicians who wish to pursue personal claims. Move along .... nothing to see here.

Ps
Should Leo dismiss Ms Bailey and make it clear that he is calling the shots (not hiding behind third party opinion) .... then I would be really impressed, but I won't hold my breath waiting on that.
Sinead wrote:
Thu May 30, 2019 2:36 pm

Toss, I don't think this matter can be swept under the carpet, I believe other matters may come during/under this investigation. As soon as Brexit is sorted out I believe there will be a General Election and Leo et al cannot come out with egg on their face on any matter or subject.
I think this tweet from Gript says it all ....

Maria Bailey makes a DODGY #swing claim, but keeps the whip and backing of Taoiseach. Lucinda Creighton voted with her conscience on abortion, upholding the party's promises on the issue, but was ostracised and forced out.

This is the new, progressive Fine Gael.


Shameless and still they gets votes....
I suspect that the reason why she retained the whip is due to the fact that loss of a TD to Fine Gael
may cause a general election due to the possibility of a subsequent by-election loss within the ever-increasing potential spectre of a no-deal Brexit.
Therefore the maintenance of the confidence and supply deal between FG & FF is vital in
order to keep the government in place to attempt to shield us in the event of a no-deal Brexit deal with Fianna Fáil.
We do not need a general election right now.


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Re: Water and other political issues.

Post by Sinead » Thu Aug 01, 2019 11:35 am

Gingertom: For all sorts of reasons we cannot have an election at this time. Having said this I would still like to know the full background to Miss Bailey's problem. It is being dripfed at the moment which is not helpful to anyone particularly at a time of loss and grief for Miss Bailey.
I wish someone in authority would stop RTE from it's very negative broadcasting, on 'chat shows' about our position vis a vie Brexit and the Backstop. The British/United Kingdom people voted for this, I would think because they were sold a pup. I wonder, how many of the Parliament have actually read the Backstop or the Good Friday Agreement or know that Ireland is a separate country. The PM seemed surprised to find a picture/portrait of the Queen did not hold pride of place in Stormont.



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Re: Water and other political issues.

Post by gingertom » Sat Aug 03, 2019 10:50 pm

Sinéad, Maria Bailey's claim details were leaked and the individual who effected the leak ignored the fact that those documents should have remained confidential until a full contested hearing took place in court.

When mooting Brexit, consider this...........is there any positive outcome for the Republic of Ireland resulting from the UK decision to leave the EU?

Very little, is my contention.

https://www.oireachtas.ie/en/committees ... agreement/

The meetings have ceased by the committee set up under this.
It is time now for the Sinn Féin MPs to take their seats and put the interests of their constituents and the people of Ireland at the forefront by attending at Westminster and voting to assure that there is no chance of a 'no-deal' Brexit.
The 8 MP's don't even have to speak on matters........they only have to heed the Division Bell and vote in the Interests of assuring that the backstop is implemented and not politically euthanised.
Johnson is merely involved in an exercise to keep the Conservative and Unionist Party unified and to preserve their power and authority within 'political England'.
The oath to sit at Westminster is a perfectly just price to pay to protect and preserve peace on our island for today and future generations.
That's what leadership is........taking responsibility and moving forward politically.


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