Water and other political issues.

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Re: Water and other political issues.

Post by Toss » Mon Aug 05, 2019 7:12 pm

Obvious solution, but would such an action convince anyone in D4 (or here) to vote SF in our next election if they did it ?


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Re: Water and other political issues.

Post by Rocker » Mon Aug 05, 2019 9:32 pm

Toss wrote:
Mon Aug 05, 2019 7:12 pm
Obvious solution, but would such an action convince anyone in D4 (or here) to vote SF in our next election if they did it ?
I have to say that there are a lot of people in the Borough who vote SF. There is an excellent, hard working SF Councillor in Killiney/Ballybrack.


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Re: Water and other political issues.

Post by Toss » Mon Aug 05, 2019 11:10 pm

.
I agree Rocker, but the bigger picture tells the story :

SF got 3.4% of the votes from Dun Laoghaire Rathdown voters in the last local election ....https://www.irishtimes.com/news/politic ... -1.3890427.

That shows the level of support they have, 96 out of every 100 votes went against them, it would take a huge shift in the electorates mind for any change. There is a fear about voting SF, I know people who think a vote for SF will have guns back on the streets and murderers running the country. I have asked people in highly qualified positions would they ever vote SF and the response is either a look of fear or a 'God no, they would ruin the country man'.

Like it or not, SF's audience is the lower classes and that is a section that probably returns the lowest voter numbers. In order for SF to succeed, middle class Ireland would need a massive change of heart and that will not happen as they have voted the same parties in for generations.

Dare I say.... there will never be a 'swing' vote to SF no matter what they do. They exist to give the minorities a reason to vote but if they get too big the Government could always change the boundaries ..... 'in order to improve the balance of representation, the electoral division of Foxrock-Beechpark is moved into the Blackrock local electoral area. The electoral division of Cabinteely-Loughlinstown is included in thelocal electoral area of Killiney -Shankill local electoral area, better aligning local electoral area boundaries' ...... not that it would ever happen :lol:

My question was not aimed at existing SF voters, but the people who have never voted for them..... would SF making such a move as suggested by GT, get them any more votes in South Dublin ? only those who have never voted Sf can answer that.


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Re: Water and other political issues.

Post by gingertom » Wed Aug 07, 2019 10:15 pm

Toss wrote:
Mon Aug 05, 2019 7:12 pm
Obvious solution, but would such an action convince anyone in D4 (or here) to vote SF in our next election if they did it ?
This needs not to be done in order to ensure a no deal Brexit.


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Re: Water and other political issues.

Post by gingertom » Wed Aug 07, 2019 10:25 pm

Toss wrote:
Mon Aug 05, 2019 11:10 pm
.
I agree Rocker, but the bigger picture tells the story :

SF got 3.4% of the votes from Dun Laoghaire Rathdown voters in the last local election ....https://www.irishtimes.com/news/politic ... -1.3890427.

That shows the level of support they have, 96 out of every 100 votes went against them, it would take a huge shift in the electorates mind for any change. There is a fear about voting SF, I know people who think a vote for SF will have guns back on the streets and murderers running the country. I have asked people in highly qualified positions would they ever vote SF and the response is either a look of fear or a 'God no, they would ruin the country man'.

Like it or not, SF's audience is the lower classes and that is a section that probably returns the lowest voter numbers. In order for SF to succeed, middle class Ireland would need a massive change of heart and that will not happen as they have voted the same parties in for generations.

Dare I say.... there will never be a 'swing' vote to SF no matter what they do. They exist to give the minorities a reason to vote but if they get too big the Government could always change the boundaries ..... 'in order to improve the balance of representation, the electoral division of Foxrock-Beechpark is moved into the Blackrock local electoral area. The electoral division of Cabinteely-Loughlinstown is included in thelocal electoral area of Killiney -Shankill local electoral area, better aligning local electoral area boundaries' ...... not that it would ever happen :lol:

My question was not aimed at existing SF voters, but the people who have never voted for them..... would SF making such a move as suggested by GT, get them any more votes in South Dublin? only those who have never voted Sf can answer that.
What I suggested was that if the Westminster Sinn Féin MPs, upon taking the requisite oath, which must be taken in order to enter Westminster did subsequently vote, if and when the opportunity might arise, against the U.K Parliament allowing the possibility of a no-deal Brexit.....it would charge matters in favour of the retention and full implementation(if necessary) of the Backstop. If Sinn Féin did this...who would form a political alliance with them in our Republic?
The history suggests that if Fine Gael supporters, gave proper due deference to Michael Collins.....maybe political expediency would prevail!
Unfortunately, Sinn Féin are not yet sufficiently responsible to be in full governmental control, in any jurisdiction.


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Re: Water and other political issues.

Post by Toss » Fri Aug 09, 2019 2:27 pm

gingertom wrote:
Wed Aug 07, 2019 10:25 pm
Unfortunately, Sinn Féin are not yet sufficiently responsible to be in full governmental control, in any jurisdiction.
I would love to see a responsible government ..... election after election each one blames the other and we are now so far down 'the Nile' that it is impossible to get an honest answer or a solution to the myriad of ongoing disasters they have presided over. Bottom line is it all goes back on the the tax payer, whether its bailing out the banks, homelessness, health sevice disasters or buying useless electronic voting machines .... its not their fault BangHead .


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Re: Water and other political issues.

Post by gingertom » Fri Aug 09, 2019 9:06 pm

Toss wrote:
Fri Aug 09, 2019 2:27 pm
gingertom wrote:
Wed Aug 07, 2019 10:25 pm
Unfortunately, Sinn Féin are not yet sufficiently responsible to be in full governmental control, in any jurisdiction.
I would love to see a responsible government ..... election after election each one blames the other and we are now so far down 'the Nile' that it is impossible to get an honest answer or a solution to the myriad of ongoing disasters they have presided over. Bottom line is it all goes back on the the tax payer, whether its bailing out the banks, homelessness, health sevice disasters or buying useless electronic voting machines .... its not their fault BangHead .
I am citing their inexperience in holding full governmental office, as a Taoiseach led administration, with the element of the background noise of radicals playing a tune of........' they haven't gone away you know!'
Its a matter of the electorate having confidence that the radical tail of dissident republicanism, will and does not wag the mainstream dog of political policy, within Sinn Féin.
I do think that a coalition involving Sinn Féin would display their approach and who knows, it may well be bona fide application of policies.
We do really need a political alternative to the previous administrations and some of the local councilors who have now been thankfully rejected at the ballot box.


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Re: Water and other political issues.

Post by Rocker » Thu Oct 31, 2019 11:18 am

I'm listening to people on the radio this morning giving excuses for the "boil water" fiasco. It would put years on you! If the whole situation wasn't so serious it would be laughable. I am watching the situation of the unrest in Chile and one of the big problems there is that water is privatised and the poorer people are being squeezed with rising prices. Huge socio economic problems there but privatised water is a big one.


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Re: Water and other political issues.

Post by Toss » Thu Oct 31, 2019 2:54 pm

Rocker wrote:
Thu Oct 31, 2019 11:18 am
I'm listening to people on the radio this morning giving excuses for the "boil water" fiasco. It would put years on you! If the whole situation wasn't so serious it would be laughable. I am watching the situation of the unrest in Chile and one of the big problems there is that water is privatised and the poorer people are being squeezed with rising prices. Huge socio economic problems there but privatised water is a big one.
Someone should ask Saint Joan and the Labour party about Chile ... you can fool some of the people etc :twisted:

Seriously though, we really dodged a bullet and should be forever grateful to all the water protesters.

Ps it will be interesting to hear how the Dun Laoghaire Swing-gate vote goes tonight..... thats if anyone is bothered voting !


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Re: Water and other political issues.

Post by Sinead » Thu Oct 31, 2019 3:51 pm

Yesterday I read and heard about a discovery in UL which seems to be fantastic. Crystals have been developed which can trap air moisture and provide water. If this works look at all the places in the world that can be helped.
I do not have a problem paying a fair amount for water, I do believe it is a very precious commodity and should not be wasted.
The recent 'boil water' debacle was a complete and utter disgrace.



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Re: Water and other political issues.

Post by Rocker » Fri Nov 01, 2019 7:58 am

Interesting times for F.G in DúnLaoghaire Rathdown. They will ditch Ms Swingate. Let's see who is on the ticket !


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Re: Water and other political issues.

Post by Sinead » Sat Jan 18, 2020 6:03 pm

Political Issues is the section I want to pursue here. Toss referred to this under 'Site'

So far I have not seen any manifestos, on TV all parties say they are going to give us everything we ever dreamed we wanted, as opposed to 'needed'. S.F. and F.F. don't inspire me, if S.P.B.P. was the only party running I would spoil my ballot. You cannot have law makers who instantly want to break the law. Whilst not enamoured with F.G. & Labour they did bring us out of a very bad crisis.... The G.P. is not yet straight forward enough. The other party S.D. I know nothing about yet. Decisions, Decisions - all ahead of me when I get some reading material.

A Local Dun Laoghaire hopeful for F.F. has invited me to the launch of his campaign in The Graduate on Sunday! Never had such an invitation before for Dail Elections.

I have no political affiliations but do enjoy the cut and trust of politics. On Thursday I say that Postal Ballot requests had to be returned on 16th! Off I went to DLRCOCO to get the requisite form - they had only received the forms that day. In order to pursue the postal ballot the form had to be signed by the Doctor. My doctor does not work on Thursday afternoons and how could I get a same day appointment?? I did call the Franchise Section but the clerk on the other end of the phone just kept quoting legislation and wouldn't hear a word about the possibility of an S.I. to change the closing date.



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Re: Water and other political issues.

Post by Toss » Sun Jan 19, 2020 12:25 am

Sinead wrote:
Sat Jan 18, 2020 6:03 pm
You cannot have law makers who instantly want to break the law.
Given the level of dodgy expense claims and false signing in debacles .... I would say there is a very limited choice left.

The country really needs a new party that is not made up of FF/FG/Labour chancers, but I cant see that happening.


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Re: Water and other political issues.

Post by Rocker » Sun Jan 19, 2020 9:53 am

As Sinead says "They are going to give us everything we ever dreamed we wanted, as opposed to 'needed'".

The other day I heard the finance fellow go on about how many thousand of jobs F.G were going to create...laughable...when some months ago with factory closures he was quizzed and he stated that the government did not create jobs they just created the climate for entrepreneurs and companies to create jobs...great how they can suddenly at the call of an election "create jobs".!!!!

I am not enamoured with the leader of S.F and in my lifetime so many things happened with links tenuous or otherwise with that party that I can't vote for them.

Labour has dwindled to nothing. When I think of the years my family spent hoping that Labour was the way and campaigning for the local man.

The greens seem too airy fairy for me though a family friend and quite a sane person went for local elections in a country bi election and I looked up and started to look at their policies. I still wait to be convinced.

F.F fellow on T,V says we have to "move on" from the problems they created before during and after the latest recession. I for one can't "move on" when so many people lost their life savings in bank shares, so many lost their home, so many went into "negative equity living in homes in pokey satellite towns" so many committed suicide rather than face ruin!Not on your nelly Mick!!

So a quandary for me who will still vote when so many women sacrificed so much to give us the vote.


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Re: Water and other political issues.

Post by Rocker » Sun Jan 19, 2020 10:07 am

Toss post got into DLRCoCo by mistake so I am copying here,

"I am going to raise the bar here and say that the biggest recent blight on our country is charities ......... I grew up with nothing and St Vincent de Paul were the only charity around. My parents (like many around them) never bothered putting their hand out as they felt there were more deserving cases out there. We got by and made do ...... it was a life lesson and one that gave us a sense of drive/focus.

Compare those days to today, where we live in a country with over 20,000 charities .... yet no one seems to be bothered to ask why we have so many ? nobody seems to wonder why the person calling to your door bedecked in their charity uniform is wearing such an expensive outfit. Its all big business and dare you ask how much of the donations actually goes to the actual cause as opposed to paying for the service. Lets not forget, the more charities that exist, the less the state has to do and the more the charities employ people, the more that state gathers in income tax.

Drugs and the murder of that young man are just another day in modern Ireland. It is just life imitating art as all those who celebrated the likes of RTEs Love/hate get to see it turn into reality ..... but God forbid they see how their ignorance has enabled young impressionable Irish kids get sucked into a life of crime. Until such time as the people of Ireland stand up and fight back against the tide of spin and bullshit that the media gives us, nothing will change.

Not a populist view, but freedom of speech allows me."


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Re: Water and other political issues.

Post by Rocker » Sun Jan 19, 2020 10:25 am

As you say Toss "Compare those days to today, where we live in a country with over 20,000 charities .... yet no one seems to be bothered to ask why we have so many ? nobody seems to wonder why the person calling to your door bedecked in their charity uniform is wearing such an expensive outfit. Its all big business and dare you ask how much of the donations actually goes to the actual cause as opposed to paying for the service. Lets not forget, the more charities that exist, the less the state has to do and the more the charities employ people, the more that state gathers in income tax."

I am always questioning why so many charities but I never get an answer...one tiny example a charity called CRY who are based in Tallaght hospital gave me great comfort and assistance on hearing of my nephew's sudden cardiac death. They made appointment to test my nephews children and their immediate cousins and we were relieved to find that the gene had not travelled to this generation. A wonderful charity who we are now fund raising for. Imagine the other day when I saw a huge campaign for another charity also dealing with sudden cardiac deaths. I feel this is diluting the work, power and impact of the older more established charity. This is just one example but how many little home made, local "charities" do we need.

During December F/B was bombarded with individuals collecting coats for the homeless and hanging them in the rain on the bridge in Dublin. I think this is daft as any charity needs a powerful strategy, powerful leadership, dynamic approach and not some kind hearted individuals thinking they are helping.

All in all the media are giving me a right pain covering issues like homelessness, drugs, povery etc they are putting such a spin on it !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


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Re: Water and other political issues.

Post by Strum » Sun Jan 19, 2020 10:19 pm

RTE "BATTLE" between FF and FG, hahahahahaha, is that some kind of oxymoronic paradox or something? Priceless. :lol:

ALL non-voters should read this and they'd realise how such a small margin of votes could change everything in this Country.
People say 'what's the point, my vote can't make a difference'. Well, here's a breakdown from the results from Dublin West from the General Election in 2016, were Leo Varadkar is based.
Of the 64,639 that were eligible to vote, only 41,952 did so.

Just under 23,000 people, meaning 1 out of every 3 people, didn't bother to exercise their right to vote. Leo Varadkar, the worst Taoiseach in the history of Ireland got 9021 votes, beat Ruth Coppinger by less than 500 votes.

Joan Brutal, remember her, laughed at people complaining about austerity because they were 'wealthy' enough to have mobile phones! She beat the Sinn Fein candidate be less than 1000 votes.
My guess is the vast majority of people who don't vote are working class people, who think their vote 'won't change anything'. But the reason nothing changes is BECAUSE people DON'T VOTE.

The Fine Gael Blueshirts base their whole strategy around the fact that 1 in 3 people won't vote.
Remember this, in a country with a population of just under 5,000,000 people, a completely out-of-touch, wealthy guy who got just over 9,000 votes represents us all. 5,000,000 people vs 9000 wealthy elites.

Don't let 9021 financially secure people decide your fate for the next four years...

By Nellie Marrinan



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Re: Water and other political issues.

Post by Toss » Mon Jan 20, 2020 12:51 am

That about nails it ..... the people who don't vote are a huge part of the problem. However do not expect the government to be bothered pushing for an everyone votes agenda, they know full well that would not guarantee them a majority.

As far as I am concerned, anyone who fails to vote on a regular basis should not get any state benefits.

We get the government that the majority vote for, what I struggle with is those who moan and gripe every election yet still give FG, FF or Labour a vote because they say 'who else?'........ well if you don't like what is offered, say so and write "none of the above" on your voting slip. Rest assured that message will get back and you can sleep at night knowing you have not contributed to some sham politician getting a state pension.

As for RTE, they are a state funded organisation and will do as they are told by their paymasters, nothing you see or hear on their stations are unfiltered.... not a chance of a straight answer, because all questions are carefully chosen.


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Re: Water and other political issues.

Post by Sinead » Mon Jan 20, 2020 10:31 am

My response will cover the last few posts:
Charities, the salaries paid to the higher ups and the nepotism is a total disgrace to the generosity of the Irish people. Again the 'my right mentality' has ruined this. The Dail Committee should have the right to question Charity employees who have taken from the system with impunity. Salaries should be capped and a ban put on employment of family members.
Strum: Forget the 'blue shirts' they went out with the high button boots, such references are, in my opinion despicable - we expect others to move on and accept and then people come up with this crap after 100 years. Move on and live in to-day's world.
Voting: The system we have is a good one, much better than first past the post. It means we can spread our choice and at least one or two of our preferences will get in. Toss, I would be totally behind your idea of no vote, no benefits. Since I got the vote, not to-day or yesterday, I have never failed to use my franchise.
How can this country address the God awful mentality that is a blight on us - not what can we do - but what am I entitled to? I have never felt I was entitled to anything, in my home the motto was what you never had you will never miss.



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Re: Water and other political issues.

Post by Toss » Thu Jan 23, 2020 10:59 am

As this is a water thread ....... https://www.pbs.org/newshour/science/fo ... -of-cities

"According to the EWG, PFAS contamination had “not been publicly reported by the Environmental Protection Agency or state environmental agencies” in 34 of the sampling locations where the chemicals were detected. " .... tip of the iceberg as far as I'm concerned, all the modern health issues (cancers, diabetes etc etc) are all man made thanks to the food and drink industry.


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Re: Water and other political issues.

Post by Strum » Thu Jan 23, 2020 3:03 pm

I don't know if polls are anything to go by because who makes them, how many people are involved in the voting etc but this is surprising if the numbers are anything to go by.

https://www.thejournal.ie/opinion-poll- ... 3-Jan2020/

What about this FF and FG coalition I read about?



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Re: Water and other political issues.

Post by Micheál » Thu Jan 23, 2020 7:38 pm

Strum wrote:
Thu Jan 23, 2020 3:03 pm
I don't know if polls are anything to go by because who makes them, how many people are involved in the voting etc but this is surprising if the numbers are anything to go by.

http://www.thejournal.ie/opinion-poll-i ... 3-Jan2020/

What about this FF and FG coalition I read about?
The size of the sample is not usually a problem - but the nature of the questions surely are -




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Re: Water and other political issues.

Post by Strum » Fri Jan 24, 2020 2:30 am

Well that culls a lot of voters. Declare an election two days before you can get your papers in order.


https://www.irishexaminer.com/breakingn ... 76630.html?



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Re: Water and other political issues.

Post by Strum » Tue Jan 28, 2020 3:41 pm

Well what're your thoughts on last night's "debate"? As far as I'm concerned the only people in that episode of the Muppets that have any sense of humanity were the ones without suits and ties, including Claire or course.



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Re: Water and other political issues.

Post by Micheál » Tue Jan 28, 2020 4:06 pm

Biggest loser was Miriam
Claire is certainly marking our her territory.

M.



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